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Discussion Starter #1
I'm going to tell on myself. Go ahead, get it out of your system now. All done? I was camping from my quad in the central Cascades, setting camp in a different place each night, sleeping in a hammock and eating freeze dried food. I had already set camp one afternoon, having slung my hammock and unloaded my gear, now I needed water. I have a Katydyn Hiker Pro water filter and knew where a stream crossed the trail. Having replenished my water supply I rode a little further down the trail (2-track) and saw fresh elk sign. I hopped off the quad and followed a nice trail for a ways. I decided to turn around and go back and promptly discovered I did not know which way was back. There were several trails going back in the direction I thought the quad was, but which one I knew not. Panic quickly set in as I realized I had nothing but a pocket knife and a helmet on my head. I had two navigation devices, compass, food, water, fire, everything imaginable on the quad but nothing with me. After wandering in circles I finally convinced myself I was lost. OK, not lost, temporarily turned around. I sat down. I didn't note where the sun was in relation to me when I hopped off the quad, but was fairly certain which direction was which, and what direction the road ran. Still....when all else fails, go downhill, which I did. Found a stream (probably the one I filled up at) and followed it, finally coming to another road I recognized. Took me 3 hours to get back to quad. Uphill. Guess what I'll never do again? Walk around with virtually nothing in my pockets. I have a fanny pack that I left home that I take hunting but not on these trips. That's gonna change. It has at least basic survival stuff compass, fire, space blanket, Life Straw, power bars. Oh and to top it off, had seen a bit of bear activity, stumps torn apart, tracks in the mud both large and small (cubs). I had a .........38 snub nose in my pocket. On the quad? Ruger Super Blackhawk in .44 Rem. Mag. loaded with 240 FMJ's. 12 guage with buck shot. Rifle (albeit in .223) Been looking for a chest rig for the .44 awhile but hadn't got one so it was tucked away on the quad. Had I ran across a cub I probably would have been best off using the .38 on myself! A sat phone is probably in my future as well.
 

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I have just ordered a Garmin hand held GPS that will allow me to set way points from Cabela's but have not received it yet. They have it on sale for $69.99, and I think this is way cheaper than a sat phone. I plan to use it mostly for when I trail ride on the Kodiak because I can be easily turned around. Back in the early 80s shortly after my wife and I were married we came to Colorado in the summer to visit her brother who was an avid elk hunter, and while there he took us for a drive into the Rockies where he hunted and while there he hiked up a mountain to a place where he buried some hunting gear to check that no one had disturbed it. He asked if we wanted to hike up with him and we declined but after a couple minutes we decided to follow him and thought we could catch up quickly. We walked up the mountain quite a ways and saw no sign of him and thought we better get back to the truck, so we turned around to retrace our path back down but after walking a while nothing looked familiar such as large boulders that weren't there on the walk up. We got back to the road but didn't know which direction to the vehicle so we started walking to the right and were heading that direction for a time when we both heard a pistol shot behind us and figured it was Craig's 357 model 19 he carried, so we turned around and walked the other way. When we were a short distance from the truck around a curve we heard him fire another round. We asked him about firing a shot earlier and he said he didn't fire but the one shot right before we came into view. This experience spooked me and I am careful about not loosing my way, and I am getting too old and decrepid to walk long distances anymore.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
I have MS so walking is difficult to begin with. I have a Garmin Oregon. It was mounted on the machine. Simple matter to grab it and stuff it in my pocket. I'll not make that mistake again. I also have a Samsung TAB A 8" mounted on the machine running US TOPO Maps Pro. The detail of the maps are awesome. The Tab was 179 I believe, the program 9 bucks and then the mounting hardware from RAM. Having all that screen is NICE compared to the Garmin. But a SAT phone would be nice when if the dung ever hit the fan. I go out alone most of the time and I know it would make my wife feel better.

I grew up in Michigan, flat land. Navigating by the seat of your pants in the mountains is some what confusing.
 

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Folks that never rode in the mountains may have a hard time relating, but sometimes you can't tell where you been, or where anything is, and the elements and the bears are very real.
I'd have a hard time walking out as I'm a overweight old fart with high blood pressure yadda yadda, but you just have to ride.
I plan on getting an offroad style GPS that allows to map out trails for posterity. How do you guys like yours?
 

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I'm going to tell on myself. Go ahead, get it out of your system now. All done? I was camping from my quad in the central Cascades, setting camp in a different place each night, sleeping in a hammock and eating freeze dried food. I had already set camp one afternoon, having slung my hammock and unloaded my gear, now I needed water. I have a Katydyn Hiker Pro water filter and knew where a stream crossed the trail. Having replenished my water supply I rode a little further down the trail (2-track) and saw fresh elk sign. I hopped off the quad and followed a nice trail for a ways. I decided to turn around and go back and promptly discovered I did not know which way was back. There were several trails going back in the direction I thought the quad was, but which one I knew not. Panic quickly set in as I realized I had nothing but a pocket knife and a helmet on my head. I had two navigation devices, compass, food, water, fire, everything imaginable on the quad but nothing with me. After wandering in circles I finally convinced myself I was lost. OK, not lost, temporarily turned around. I sat down. I didn't note where the sun was in relation to me when I hopped off the quad, but was fairly certain which direction was which, and what direction the road ran. Still....when all else fails, go downhill, which I did. Found a stream (probably the one I filled up at) and followed it, finally coming to another road I recognized. Took me 3 hours to get back to quad. Uphill. Guess what I'll never do again? Walk around with virtually nothing in my pockets. I have a fanny pack that I left home that I take hunting but not on these trips. That's gonna change. It has at least basic survival stuff compass, fire, space blanket, Life Straw, power bars. Oh and to top it off, had seen a bit of bear activity, stumps torn apart, tracks in the mud both large and small (cubs). I had a .........38 snub nose in my pocket. On the quad? Ruger Super Blackhawk in .44 Rem. Mag. loaded with 240 FMJ's. 12 guage with buck shot. Rifle (albeit in .223) Been looking for a chest rig for the .44 awhile but hadn't got one so it was tucked away on the quad. Had I ran across a cub I probably would have been best off using the .38 on myself! A sat phone is probably in my future as well.


I hear you man. Got lost with my older brother 20 years ago. Took 4 hours before we finally hit a trail we recognized and aventually found my dad's Yamaha 350 moto 4 at the end of that trail. We rode home that evening shaken from the experience. Things like that happen fast and can happen to anyone.

Now, 20 years later I often ride fair distances from civilization alone with my Atv, boat and snowmobile. Often my issue is their simply no one else to ride with.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
Folks that never rode in the mountains may have a hard time relating, but sometimes you can't tell where you been, or where anything is, and the elements and the bears are very real.
I'd have a hard time walking out as I'm a overweight old fart with high blood pressure yadda yadda, but you just have to ride.
I plan on getting an offroad style GPS that allows to map out trails for posterity. How do you guys like yours?

Love the Oregon. It eats up batteries pretty quick when not plugged into the quad. Otherwise I usually carry several spares. LOVE the TAB setup I have although it's not waterproof.
 

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Love the Oregon. It eats up batteries pretty quick when not plugged into the quad. Otherwise I usually carry several spares. LOVE the TAB setup I have although it's not waterproof.

The Oregon seems to do better with rechargeable batteries . . . just be sure to switch over to the rechargeable batteries in the set up as not doing so will definitely eat up the batteries quicker.
 

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It happens. I finally broke down and got a Hill people Gear chest rig for when I ride an ATV or carry a back pack. It has worked out far better than I hoped. Enough gear to get by with and I can carry a full sized pistol with ease. I don't really notice it and it doesn't bounce enough to notice even with spirited riding.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
It happens. I finally broke down and got a Hill people Gear chest rig for when I ride an ATV or carry a back pack. It has worked out far better than I hoped. Enough gear to get by with and I can carry a full sized pistol with ease. I don't really notice it and it doesn't bounce enough to notice even with spirited riding.
What pistol do you carry in it
 

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Discussion Starter #11
I carry a Glock 22 and have a MIC holster to cover the trigger guard. I could probably carry my 44 RedHawk. I haven't tried though.
I looked through the Hill People web site, couldn't find a Super Blackhawk w/a 7.5" barrel listed. Will call tomorrow but I'm prolly gonna go w/a Chestrig.
 

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I looked through the Hill People web site, couldn't find a Super Blackhawk w/a 7.5" barrel listed. Will call tomorrow but I'm prolly gonna go w/a Chestrig.

I don't know if you could squeeze a 7 1/2 in Black Hawk in there. Maybe. But it would be tight,
 

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Discussion Starter #14
Finally.....a chest rig. And a new pistol! Holster is a Kenai by Gunfighters Inc. Pistol S&W model 29-10 4". Rides pretty high and seems to be out of the way of everything. Reckon I can prolly sleep with it on in my hammock. Talked to a feller who was hammock camping in the Blues of SE WA, said he was woke one night by what he thought was a bear nudging his underside. Might be a trail-tale, but ya never know.

As an aside, I know a lot of people swear by bear spray. I'm, sure it's effective 98% of the time. But google the hunting guide in Wyoming who was eaten by a Grizzly last fall. His bear spray was empty. The client survived. Fish and game found and shot the bear. It's head and shoulders were soaked in bear spray. The Guides gun was.....in his pack.
 

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There is a lot more to the story on the guide that was killed in Wyoming and quite a bit different than what you listed.

Bear spray is effective but like a lot of things it isn't 100% effective and neither is a .44 magnum. I know a outfitter in British Colombia that just pissed off a grizzly when he shot it with his .44 magnum and if it wasn't for the hunter with a .300 magnum rifle he also would of been meat to the bear.
 

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Discussion Starter #16 (Edited)

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That's just it, no one know when the spray was first used. At the elk caucus or during the second attack. The bear spray canister was found with the guides body 50' away from the elk.

In my opinion he trusted his life to someone who was unfamiliar with the Glock and it didn't end up well.

I know that on some bear spray that I have read the warnings on it does state that it may not be effective on overly aggressive bears. But then again neither is a .44 mag unless you hit something vital with the first couple of shots.
 

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Discussion Starter #18
That's just it, no one know when the spray was first used. At the elk caucus or during the second attack. The bear spray canister was found with the guides body 50' away from the elk.

In my opinion he trusted his life to someone who was unfamiliar with the Glock and it didn't end up well.

I know that on some bear spray that I have read the warnings on it does state that it may not be effective on overly aggressive bears. But then again neither is a .44 mag unless you hit something vital with the first couple of shots.
I second your opinion that he trusted his life to someone he shouldn't have. But. a 10mm for bear protection?? I believe one of the articles I read said the bear, after they killed it, was soaked about the head and shoulders with the spray. When it was deployed may forever remain a mystery.

I've always been told and/or read that a round for a bear should be a solid lead or FMJ. An expanding bullet most likely will expand before reaching a vital. I may not find myself in Grizzly country but I do know I won't be brush-busting again without one of my .44's (maybe two!) strapped on me. Plenty of black bears here in WA.

And there's another point. Automatics are too complicated for the average person. Even the experienced person under duress is most likely gonna have problems with a mis-fire, mis-feed, stove-pipe etc. A revolver......pull the trigger and it goes bang. Misfire? Pull the trigger again:smile2:
 

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I second your opinion that he trusted his life to someone he shouldn't have. But. a 10mm for bear protection?? I believe one of the articles I read said the bear, after they killed it, was soaked about the head and shoulders with the spray. When it was deployed may forever remain a mystery.

I've always been told and/or read that a round for a bear should be a solid lead or FMJ. An expanding bullet most likely will expand before reaching a vital. I may not find myself in Grizzly country but I do know I won't be brush-busting again without one of my .44's (maybe two!) strapped on me. Plenty of black bears here in WA.

And there's another point. Automatics are too complicated for the average person. Even the experienced person under duress is most likely gonna have problems with a mis-fire, mis-feed, stove-pipe etc. A revolver......pull the trigger and it goes bang. Misfire? Pull the trigger again:smile2:
You must not ever shot a Glock. It's about as hard as using a mouse. Just point and click.
 

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I'd have to go back through a lot of reading but I believe that there wasn't a round in the chamber. That along with the client not being familiar with it or even firearms resulted in what happened, but we will never know just what went down.
 
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